What is the BDGA?

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rhatton1
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What is the BDGA?

Post by rhatton1 » Tue May 17, 2016 11:04 am

Seems a stupid question, but seriously, what is it?

Is it the "BDGA Tour" serving those that actively tour only or does it have a wider remit?

I'm honestly still not sure.

I believe there is an extraordinary General Meeting taking place this weekend, the first I have seen of it is an easily missed post on Facebook talking about it. Why is this the first I have seen of it?

Because I'm not a touring member.

Why am I not a touring member?

Because with a young family and huge time commitments attempting to grow the sport I can't tour! I have not received value for money on BDGA membership since 2010 yet have made my donation for the last 5 years, this year with at best the chance of one British Tour event and probably not even that it did not seem a worthwhile use of limited personal funds.

Yet this year I am running at least 12 events which will generate upwards of £400 for the BDGA coffers. (Burt, I need an invoice for Redditch please by the way - 30 players!)

I'm installing and in the process of installing new courses all over and actively engaging and exciting landowners who have never heard of it before with Disc Golf.

I was (admittedly in a limited capacity) involved in the rewriting of the constitution which i'm assuming this EGM is about?

But because I don't tour I have no say or access to the EGM discussing the future direction of the sport in this country. If the discussion is just about the tour then fine, I'm not involved, I should have no say. If it is about the growth of the sport then I couldn't really be any more involved. This is why I ask the question "What is the BDGA?"

When it started the BDGA offered more value for money than just discounted tour events. If that is now not possible can there be a separate lower nominal, £3 say, yearly subscription to be a voting included member? This a group for people who are doing huge amounts in their local areas to grow the sport but aren't able to get all over the country to tour (tour events, some of which, quite frankly, never seem to leave any legacy anyway). A group for people that are passionate about the direction the sport is heading in the country but aren't involved in the tour which should only be one facet of the BDGA.

Reading this it seems whiny - look at me, why aren't I involved, value me etc etc. It's not meant to be - the idea of writing this is to highlight that Disc Golf in the UK is far far more than the British Tour, some of the main stuff being done is being done by people that will never get to four BDGA tour events a year, yet that seems to be the only focus from the BDGA and it is totally bought home by only being able to have involvement with the future of the organisation if you are a "touring member"
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by rhatton1 » Tue May 17, 2016 11:24 am

This isn't just a semantics thing either.

you play four events you have covered your £17 and effectively made £3.

You play one event, BDGA membership has cost you £12

Membership is currently designed to be beneficial only for Touring members, yet touring members aren't necessarily doing any more for the sport or the BDGA than turning up at tour events.
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by bruce » Tue May 17, 2016 1:24 pm

The BDGA is, clearly, about more than just the tour.

From the constitution:
ARTICLE I - PURPOSES
The Association is a non-profit organisation established and organised by the members, for the members, exclusively for educational purposes and to foster local, regional and national sports competition, including, but not limited to, such purposes as:
1. To serve as the national governing body of Disc Golf, with responsibility for sanctioning local, regional and national championship events, making available the Official Rules of Disc Golf, ensuring the observance of official standards for and recording of national records;
2. To encourage and protect the spirit of flying disc play;
3. To promote awareness and acceptance of Disc Golf as a sport;
4. To encourage the growth of Disc Golf as a sport in the British Isles;
5. To provide a forum for discussion of all aspects of Disc Golf among the affiliated members; and
6. Consistent with the above principles, to transact any and all other lawful business or businesses for which an Association may be established.
Item 4 is a new proposed addition.
Membership is currently designed to be beneficial only for Touring members
I take issue with this. Yes, there are incentives provided to membership, namely discounted entry. But that is not what the fees are for. The BDGA doesn't receive £5 per non-member at each event, it receives £17 per member. The BDGA could really care less whether those members Tour or not (barring tournament tax, and of course the goal of growing the sport!), the purpose of the fees is to fund running the organisation.

Looking at the fees as a pure discount vs events played calculation utterly misses the point. The fees cover your costs as a member to the organisation, namely development, insurance, membership of wider sporting bodies and hopefully soon, a paid administrator. The fact that you get discounted entry into events is a bonus.

I actually do think it is a semantics thing. Maybe the memberships should be referred to as 'Full' and 'Associate' as per the constitution, the revised one has the amendment "Full (also known as ‘Touring’):", but really the difference is paying vs non-paying. In any organisation, if you're not a fully paid up member you don't get a vote. You also don't get invited to the AGM (or EGM). You're not a member, so honestly, why should you have a say in the governance of the Membership Association? It's not because you don't tour, it's because you aren't a current member.
[Standard post disclaimer] My posts are never intended to undermine the work of the Board or individuals putting in effort to grow the sport, they are my honest thoughts on the best ways to grow the game

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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by bruce » Tue May 17, 2016 1:34 pm

On the 'Touring' thing, we originally split a flat membership fee into two paid tiers 'Non-touring' (maybe £10? It was a while ago, I forget) and 'Touring (£16?), both of which were voting 'full' members. That was because we were adding PDGA membership into the Touring membership and recognised that might not be for everyone.

After running that for 2-3 years, we typically had just 1-2% of members as 'non-touring', so it was decided (at AGM) to drop it as unnecessary bureaucracy. The 'Touring' label continued, and probably should have just gone back to 'Full'.

Funnily enough, this year once again there are 2 tiers of membership, with PDGA (£30) and without PDGA (£17), so we've come full circle, albeit because increasingly some players have sorted their own PDGA, rather than not wanting it.
[Standard post disclaimer] My posts are never intended to undermine the work of the Board or individuals putting in effort to grow the sport, they are my honest thoughts on the best ways to grow the game

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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by rhatton1 » Tue May 17, 2016 3:19 pm

I think you're missing my point.

But F5ck it.

Whatevs.
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by LostMeow » Tue May 17, 2016 4:19 pm

I've been thinking about two potential models (with grey area in between) in which the BDGA could operate:

The right-wing Small Government model:
BDGA exists to look after BDGA Tour only (plus associated British Disc Golf matters - the Nationals and the EDGC team).
Coordinating Tour events, insurance for those events, points race, crowning champions.
Membership fees low.
Majority of disc golf in UK exists outside BDGA remit - private companies in the free market assumed to fill any void that exists.

The left-wing Big Government model:
BDGA exists to look after all disc golf in the UK.
Majority of disc golf in UK exists within BDGA remit.
BDGA actively involved in course development and outreach around the country.
Membership fees higher to fund its many enterprises.

Obviously there's a sliding scale in-between. Which end of the spectrum do you think would be better?
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by Neil M » Tue May 17, 2016 5:01 pm

Well said Rich Hatton. I have not been a member for the last 2 seasons for similar reasons to you (family and limited chance to go on tour). Currently the BDGA appears to be excluding anyone who isn't a touring member with nothing to entice those members in. Perhaps the small government model would be best. That is essentially how it currently operates (in my perception) and it struggles to do any of the development and outreach stuff effectively (not necessarily through any fault of the BDGA). Perhaps it should scale back and focus on what it knows how to do well?
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by rhatton1 » Wed May 18, 2016 1:30 am

Why does anyone pay to join an organisation?

Generally, and I am sure there are exceptions, they expect something in return individually. Every bdga benefit is tour related. Every bdga incentive is tour related.

If you ask someone that is not going to get to four events in the year to pay as much as someone who is you are asking them to make a donation. It doesn't matter what the bdga gets from the deal this is the value for money for the member. There is none for non tourers.

The issue here is that the bdga claims to be the national governing body of the sport. Right now it's the national tour operator, a job it does well. But by forcing people wishing to have involvement with the sport to subsidise the tour with their membership fee in order to be involved with the national body is not fair. Simply put its not fair, a touring member gets a benefit to be involved a non touring member doesn't.

i would scrap the membership fee and the discounts at events in favour of increased per head taxes at bdga two day events. (I'd be careful on increasing one day tour series events as 20 one day events insurance a year can be found cheaper than the bdga insurance is currently working out.) You get what you pay for then as a player rather than some getting more than others.offer out good value insurance schemes to local leagues and tour series under th bdga banner on the back of a nominal £3 a year membership with no discounts to events but a chance to be involved in the sports organisation.

The bdga is and has been failing for sometime to engage with the thousands of regular grassroots players in the country in favour of focusing on the 80 or so players likely to play in four or more tour events. I would be willing to bet there is a stark correlation between paid up members and people that have played 3 or more events in the year. If there hasn't been in the past there certainly will be at the end of this year as there are lots of old members who used to pay despite not playing who haven't renewed this year (so they tell me might not be true) It's currently the national tour not the national body.

I played a round with,let's call him player a tonight, he's been playing a couple of years, is properly addicted has played every mods event this year and is at most local events helps out with stuff and will be a good asset to the sport.

Are you a member of the bdga?
No
Why not?
Because I'm not going on tour?

Genuine conversation without any leading from my part and one that could be played out over and over around the country. Players disengaged with the national body because it is of no benefit to them.
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by rhatton1 » Wed May 18, 2016 8:40 am

To add to this one of the biggest benefits the BDGA could put in place is insurance schemes for clubs and the smaller leagues and events.

Currently it is there for one and 2 day events. If it could be added in for leagues and even a personal liability option covering people throwing in fields or parks outside of events this would be a real member benefit worth paying for and which the BDGA should be able to both make money on and offer cheaper than someone getting it individually. If to get this a player had to pay £3 annually to become a BDGA member I am pretty sure your numbers and grass roots engagement would rise pretty quickly. At £17, I doubt it.
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by Greig » Wed May 18, 2016 12:19 pm

rhatton1 wrote: I played a round with,let's call him player a tonight, he's been playing a couple of years, is properly addicted has played every mods event this year and is at most local events helps out with stuff and will be a good asset to the sport.

Are you a member of the bdga?
No
Why not?
Because I'm not going on tour?

Players disengaged with the national body because it is of no benefit to them.
That could've been me, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't.

The BDGA are missing out on INCOME. Real honest to goodness income, tax / membership fee / subscriptions , whatever you want to call it, MONEY.

Money is a good thing, it means you as an organisation can do things otherwise unable to do. Offer something to the "floating player" .

We cant get on tour because we're family people, we cant be away for 10 weekends of a year, we're maybe not good enough to play on tour anyway. We love the day out and the competition but we're not playing at 950 rated rounds. We're down here, 830 and less. There are more of us than you!

OFFER SOMETHING for membership. Even more so we cannot get on to tour as events are selling out with months to go this year, we are the unwashed, the downtrodden, the ignored, but most importantly for you the Untaxed.

I got my PDGA membership sorted for and through the MODS. The PDGA look after me, they give me a rating,a rule book they update it for me, so I can see how bad I really am. (all nothing really, but it makes me feel I belong for £12.00) I would have done it through the BDGA I suspect, but at the time you weren't offering it.

Or, stay as you are, effectively a National League, a clique of disc golfers, not a governing body and let the growth happen around you, because it will, this thing is getting bigger in the UK and the National governing body needs to step up and embrace it, along with all the new players coming along. Get their cash too!


Only posting to put my point of view. I want to belong but I do not want to / cannot play on tour.

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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by Del » Wed May 18, 2016 12:34 pm

I think the BDGA should attract the majority of players who compete in events, be they Tour events or one day events, and hopefully a good number of non-competitors who none-the-less want to keep informed and show their support. If the BDGA only attracts Touring players as members, then in my opinion it is failing, and will become a preserve of a small clique, which will become an increasingly small fraction of the player base as the sport grows.
The BDGA needs to offer benefits and not simply be a tax collector. There is a difficulty in identifying member benefits that are appealing but inexpensive in cost and administrative time. We could look at discounts with retailers, preferential entry to events, earlier or exclusive access to content (via e-mail or website) and so on.
The membership fee should then be set at a level which represents value for money and marketed to attract the majority of active competitors. This is of course subjective, but at the moment the BDGA is largely parasitic (and I apologise for the rather ugly phrase) extracting money from people who wish to play tour events, whilst not actually contributing to the running of those events.
One of the things that has driven up membership fees has been the desire to have funds for development activity. I'm coming to think that at this point, the basic membership fee should not bear much if any of that cost. I think there should be an opt-in development contribution which should be marketed to make people feel good about opting in. As I recall, the option to give more didn't really give any feel-good factor. The use of development money is a potentially contentious area and I think it would be far better to look at raising funds by crowdfunding appeals. In that way people vote with their own cash for the cases that they support, and that support comes from more than just the small base of touring members. BDGA money could be used for smaller initiatives such as producing flyers and the occasional stall at leisure events.
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by Toby » Wed May 18, 2016 4:53 pm

I agree with Greig; I honestly cannot see where the money goes for BDGA membership and what the benefits are (apart from discounts at tour events which I generally can't go to due to travel expenses and not having enough time).

For example, I'm going to University this year and start a Disc Golf Club, but I honestly can't think of any support that the BDGA is offering to new clubs. I hear that a portion of membership goes towards "development", but there is no information whatsoever on how to even apply for the development money or even how much you can get. With the greatest of respect, I'd love to see some actual evidence of that money being used for development and where it's going.

There don't seem to be any events or programs that the BDGA offers that directly grow the game outside of the National Tour. Going back to my situation playing disc golf at University, there is only one competition for Universities held in the country, which is currently held once a year in Scotland (putting it out of reach of most English and Welsh Universities), which doesn't appear to be ran by the BDGA even though it is classed as the National University Championships (please correct me if I'm wrong). Yet Universities should be an absolute gold mine for sport participation, so why isn't this being taken advantage of? Outside of Universities, there don't appear to be any events dedicated to make the public more aware of the sport, such as "Have a Go" sessions, even though one of the BDGA's purposes is to promote awareness of the sport.

Disc Golf isn't even recognised as a sport in the UK, let alone the BDGA being its recognised NGB. There are so much developmental money that could be accessed by clubs through recognition which could help boost participation, but we can't, because we're not recognised yet.

I would quite happily pay the membership if I saw the benefits the money has on all levels of the sport, but at the moment, I can't see that the BDGA is fulfilling that.

- Toby

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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by LostMeow » Wed May 18, 2016 6:14 pm

Toby wrote:For example, I'm going to University this year and start a Disc Golf Club, but I honestly can't think of any support that the BDGA is offering to new clubs. I hear that a portion of membership goes towards "development", but there is no information whatsoever on how to even apply for the development money or even how much you can get. With the greatest of respect, I'd love to see some actual evidence of that money being used for development and where it's going.
On that point specifically: we are aware of the gaping hole where Development should be and are (honestly) drawing up plans for an open and active team with funds at their disposal. When that comes together I hope that projects such as yours will be exactly the sorts of thing that BDGA money gets used for.
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by rhatton1 » Wed May 18, 2016 8:32 pm

So, I've signed up.

I noticed the £8 to youth development. First time I had seen this and never seen anything else about it?

On that note, I'm curious, where does the equipment for this get sourced? Is there a bdga preferred supplier? Has anything been purchased to date? We have plenty of stock if required at disc golf UK at competitive prices....
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by seamus » Thu May 19, 2016 7:49 am

rhatton1 wrote:So, I've signed up.
I know this is a heated discussion on Facebook but I'd rather share my thoughts here.
As a non-member of the Bdga I think it is perfectly fair to have no vote in Board driven agenda.
As a non-member I am a little disheartened that the Bdga would not strongly pursue disseminating important information to all UK disc golfers in a hope to be more inclusive and attract membership renewals.

As a TD I'm still a little achy and tired.
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by rhatton1 » Thu May 19, 2016 11:42 am

long read lifted from facebook Messenger but worth it - conversation with the Finnish National Director Tapani Aulu (copied and posted with permission):

rich: Hi, Quick question about the set up of the Finnish Association and the PDGA - Bruce mentioned all sanctioning goes through the Finnish association so no one gets tournaments sanctioned in Finland directly through the PDGA it all goes through you first. Is this true, if so why and do you charge extra fees for this? Do you give any benefits in return? Thanks

Tapani: we just want everyone to apply through us to ensure quality
also we only accept tournaments hosted by our club teams
not individuals
currently the NA pays the sanctioning fees
so it actually costs the association about 10 000 dollars a year

Rich: I'm running a 12 event tour series, one of the draws is PDGA sanctioning and ratings. it's been very successful has produced more new PDGA members than the BDGA this year and will actually pay more to the PDGA than the BDGA in event sanctioning this year. I don't really understand the need to go through the BDGAr. They have been intimating that the finnish set up is this - what do you charge the clubs to run a tournament or don't you?

Tapani: we PAY them grin emoticon
we charge nothing and we pay the PDGA sanctioning fee

Rich: Thank you , great to know!

Tapani: so the NA gets nothing else than the peace of mind that we know what and where is happening and we can help the organizers

Rich: Wow, can I run tournaments in Finalnd please!

Tapani: for new hosts we take more care and for "repeat offenders" we basically just stamp the applications
and it is also totally okay for a club to apply for a tournament, but then hire someone to actually run it
there is this guy who owns the frisbeeervice.fi that runs about 10-20 evetns a year all around

Rich: Thank you, great help and puts my mind at ease.
do you offer insurance options to the organisers, do the clubs pay a yearly membership to the FA or anything, or is this all generated through player memberships?

Tapani: the clubs pay 2 € per member
there is an overall liability insurance for events, which is as far as I know only for damages to any 3rd party
then we have a deal for all players that they can pay personal insurance that covers basically everything. that is only 7 € per year

Rich: is that per event or per club annually/

Tapani: all clubs pay 2 € per their member per year
so that is pretyt nominal, but generates about 10 000 € anyways

Rich: These are exactly the things I have been saying the BDGA should introduce! Does that insurance cover players practising in a field?

Tapani: it does
there is a major insurance company that pretty much does it for all sports in finland
so they can offer these crazy rates
also we charge 50 € for a licence for competing players
through their club
that includes the PDGA membership, so it generates about 20 € per member for the NA
that comes to be about 20x2500=50 000 € this year

Rich: cool think our insurance will probably be more but still would be good. How did you become so club orientated rather than individuals? we are lacking that club structure

Tapani: we have been moving towards there after we passed 500 members
then when it was past 2000 members it was pretty obvious we will go 100% club memberships
we now have 105 clubs and 4500 members

Rich: wow.

Tapani: probably will pass 5000 this year

Rich: Are all club members FA members to?

Tapani: yes
2100 are competing players so also PDGA members

Rich: Are there any paid roles or is this all run by volunteer member organisations

Tapani: we just hired our first full time employee this year
last year we hade a part time person

Rich: so do the non pdga players just pay the 2€ and the €7 personal liability (if they want it) or are there any other costs?

Tapani: the 2 € is paid by the -club-
so they charge it in their membership fees

Rich: and that is all it takes to be a member fo the FA with voting rights?

Tapani: the 7€ is paid straight to the insurance company, we just offer links basically

Rich: do you get a kickback from the insurance company?

Tapani: we don't
it's all done straight player-insurance
we do nothing in the middle, just negotiated the deal
much easier for us

Rich: sorry for so many questions, but you are basically describing the model I would like over heer!

Tapani: feel free to cite me on anything

Rich: thank you

Tapani: but about voting rights
indivitual members do not have a vote at all
clubs have votes
proportionally to their size

Rich: interesting

Tapani: so the NA only has clubs as members
so we have 105 members currently

Rich: What other services does the NA provide?

Tapani: the biggest clubs are about 300 strong
smallest are just half a dozen
so in the 2 annual meetings the clubs have votes
well, obviously they will send a delegate
to use their votes
but basically the votes are just for the board members

rich: What services does the NA provide for clubs?

Tapani: well that's a bit more complicated. we have a LOT going on grin emoticon
the main thing is this: https://kisakone.frisbeegolfliitto.fi/kilpailut/2016
every event in one single sign up rystem
system
also we have grants for projects
we have training/coachign program
there are all kinds of stuff,

Rich: This is everything I have been asking for!

Tapani: we also have an annual weekend long planning event
where delegates get to plan, suggests, get to sit through (boring) presentations etc.
for planning coing seasns
and we have a VISION 2022 which we started in 2012
and are working towards pretty ambitiously
some of the things including that disc golf will be an affordable sport and available for everyone in the country and be recognized as a major sport
which is not far from reality now

Rich: The main point of the compny I've set up is to acheive that goal!
You've just energised me thanks Tapani. Nice to know it can work

Tapani: it can
like its pretty cool to have major chains promoting disc golf apparel on the commercial breaks of the ice hockey world championship matches
and I'm not talking about disc golf stores or even sports stores
but they are literatlly in all supermarkets nowadays grin emoticon
a regular hyper market that has a sports section, may have a stock of a THOUSAND discs
on display on their best location

Rich: Wow, Jussi must be raking it in!

tapani: not just jussi
there are lots of stores that dont even carry discmania/innova
but instead other brands


thats a wall in a Prisma, which is a supermarket, mostly selling food and clothes: https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/t51.2 ... Mg%3D%3D.2
just random google image search

Rich: jesus.

Tapani: looks like at least discraft, west side, prodigy, innova,
prodiscus is one of the brands you find regularly anywhere
depends on a lot of the buyer of the store
there is a local Intersport in Turku that has a decent level player as their buyer
they know what to do
im going there in an hour, I can take a photo for you
got if from the guy who works there grin emoticon
he was online

Rich: just wow - that's a supermarket?

Tapani: that's an Intersport
so a general spots store
sports

Rich: ah ok but still!

Tapani: looks like 25 rows, 7 columns and 12 discs in each
that makes 2000+

Rich: Are there any other benefits for the tourning members included in the €50? If I was to play at an avent in Finland would i have to pay for the license before playing or can people just be PDGA memebrs and not NA associates?
Last questin i promise!

Tapani: foreign players only need a valid PDGA membership
finns must be members

Rich: Which costs them effectively €35 ish a year, and is required to play in any PDGA events

Tapani: yep

Rich: Are there other benefits for that?

Tapani: well for finns its the whole package, nothing specific to that. it's just the "national licence" that then funds the entire venture
we used to have two options

Rich: do they receive naything with memebrship - discs etc?

b: 20 € and you can play national tournaments, no pdga membership and then 55 € for both
for this year we went with one option only
no, no membership "junk"

Rich: Is there any issue with players that can only play one event a year? How many events do your members normally play?

Tapani: Tuomo Tanskanen might have those stats, but since there is already 150 events in the calendar and will for sure be more than 200 this year, there is a lot of chances to compete

Rich: Ah, you donl;t charge a tournament tax to the clubs at all do you, so this is the main/only income

Tapani: yep

Rich: Ok, just want to have my facts straight!

Tapani: we did get 40 000 € grant from the state this year
last year we got 20 000 and before that we weren't big enough to get anything
that is why we were able to hire someone full time
we also offer 10 free Certified official exams per club per year
that also amounts to about 10 000 a year if all of them use them
not all will, so it'll be more like 5000 probably
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by rhatton1 » Thu May 19, 2016 12:03 pm

What do I personally make of that?

A paid administrator role with our level of members and guaranteed levels of income is probably naive and not something for the short term unfortunately.

They have really supported and pushed tournaments trying to make them as cheap and easily accessible as possible. Their current annual "license" to play in PDGA tour events is around £28 with no member discounts after PDGA costs are taken out, however there are no tournament taxes in this model. They require any Finnish based player to have a license before they play in a PDGA event (didn't ask him about PDGA laegues). Not sure that could work here yet and would I expect be a barrier to tournament entries. They have 200 tournaments a year so plenty of choice to play in we have limited # so VFM is not yet here for that license. I think we could generate this same income though with a nominal lower "license" and tournament taxes instead . That way those that play more pay more, those that play less don't, it seems fairer with limited playing options yet.

How do we build a club structure? This is something I've always felt that the BDGA could take a much better guiding hand with and the Finnish model shows how successful it can be. This gives locals ownership of their own area but also inclusion into something bigger. BDGA clubs around the country with a structure and all the essentials (insurance etc) and guidance put in place already has to be a good thing. They support the clubs and take pressure off the local TD's by paying the sanctioning for all events - As a TD I've always been concerned I might not get 15 players and cover costs, this negates that. They pay for the officials exams rather than asking volunteers to pay themselves. Private companies can support the club structure by offering percentage discounts in stores to BDGA club members (DGUK are happy to provide this) Any local club member dues are quickly made back from this.

The voting rights is interesting.

What do i really make of it?

If we're going down a paid route, let's pay Tapani to come over here and do it for us....
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by rhatton1 » Thu May 19, 2016 12:15 pm

don't need to have the license for leagues, but the FNA pays the $25 sanctioning agreement as well making it a bit of a no brainer for clubs to run one.
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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by bruce » Thu May 19, 2016 1:55 pm

Tricky to read much into the financial model, as effectively they are subsidised by the Finnish government. Good luck getting the Tories to fund us!

There is an element of chicken and egg here, I wanted to develop a club membership for years, but there weren't enough courses with clubs to make it work from an insurance perspective. We might just about be there now, insurance really is the only solid benefit and last I checked we needed a minimum of 10 clubs signed up to be eligible.

I think taking the sanctioning in house and paying the fees could work under a per-player taxation model, effectively subsidising small events to encourage growth and 'cashing in' on the larger ones, say £4/5 per player and the BDGA covers the sanctioning fee and insurance.

The 'club voting' piece would be a massive change and I'm not sure how that works, does each club have to have a 'mini election' to decide who the club votes for?
[Standard post disclaimer] My posts are never intended to undermine the work of the Board or individuals putting in effort to grow the sport, they are my honest thoughts on the best ways to grow the game

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Re: What is the BDGA?

Post by rhatton1 » Thu May 19, 2016 2:38 pm

bruce wrote:
The 'club voting' piece would be a massive change and I'm not sure how that works, does each club have to have a 'mini election' to decide who the club votes for?
I imagine as with most of these things that the majority of players don't care enough or aren't informed enough to make a decision and so leave it to the elected club officials to vote in the best interests of the local club.

It's an intriguing way of doing things, I can't think of a similar situation I've come across. Almost like voting for your parish councilors and then letting them vote in the national elections on your behalf. It's not one person one vote but you are in a position to effect change locally more easily and then see that reflected in the national sphere, possibly leading to more engagement with the process. It's certainly interesting. Whats the biggest voting turnout the BDGA has ever had, probably last years elections? with the club way I would imagine it's close to 100% each time.

Insurance would be the big benefit, but if there could be one club structure, one web host, hosting the smaller sites, a basic structure of everything club related that the individuals could build on it would make life a lot easier than stating totally from scratch which is daunting. It might be the impetus we need to actually get the Coventry and Warwickshire club running properly under a BDGA banner. Feels like there are enough active clubs now around the country and i'm sure could persuade some others to form if it was easy to do. Seems the best way to get grass roots development going- there's nothing better for an areas development than a dedicated club, if they were all there under the BDGA banneri feel like there are benefits there, just not sure what they are exactly.
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